Vauxhall Insignia 2014 Shaking Violently when in Drive (D) gear - Auto Transmission

[Witty]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/143624182313

There you go.

[Sysek]

Hi All,

I have same sharp thud issue when put in D but also when put in R but lot less violently, when in semi-auto its gear 2 when jerks on mine.
Oil drained dark, tiny redness to it, bit burned smell, but not silver at all. Changed oil with flush as per some youtube guides ( this one is on volvo but its same gearbox)

https://youtu.be/EAb9p8Wph-M

No change on mine aftere oi l change to D but in R has improved. did not took for a good ride as yet. I'd like to try and reset the gearbox ecu if anyone know the best method? Is the old school battery disconnect would work?
Thanks

[plasma]

Gearbox relearn has to be done by diagnostic tool but even then its lumpy/bangy until its relearned properly....

Also i wonder whether the gearbox has died due to water in it like the vectra autos suffered?

[Sysek]

Gearbox relearn has to be done by diagnostic tool but even then its lumpy/bangy until its relearned properly....

Also i wonder whether the gearbox has died due to water in it like the vectra autos suffered?

Would this require GD2 ? I'm quite new to Vauxhall but got the gd2 and could not find relearn option . I did reset on adaptive values but not sure if this would suffice?
I did not find any signs of water ingress or presence in the drained oil ( 3xtimes flush).
Many thanks

[plasma]

i will have a look on mine tomorrow see where the option is

[Sysek]

i will have a look on mine tomorrow see where the option is

Sorry for a nudge but have had a chance to check your diagnostic soft?
Mine required gds2 as it's 2015 insignia. Unless there is better different/better out there?
Thanks

[plasma]

been working today so not had a chance to go out yet, will charge laptop now and have a poke later tonight

[plasma]

Had a look....

On GDS2 its Transmission Control Module / Configuration&Reset / Reset learned values

[Sysek]

Had a look....

On GDS2 its Transmission Control Module / Configuration&Reset / Reset learned values

Many thanks Plasma!
I think I have done this one although not given it a test drive as it made no difference when parked and switching between N D & R. But will do tomorrow to give a chance to learn new ones.
On another note would it not be something to do with valve body failing to operate correctly or one of its solenoid valves? There few options there on GDS2 for solenoid valves but I dont know what are correct operational values for any of them.
Looks like when solenoid valve 2 engages then this thud occurs. When it activates its mV jumps up to similar values (between 500-900mV) as other do when engaging their gears.
many thanks

[ade555]

I hope your problem will be solved via the reset but I can only talk from my own previous experience on auto boxes, your video will usually indicate knackered valve body due to old oil and overheating issue, now when you change oil and you will have to change few times as half of it is inside the torque converter and with out removing this you have no way of draining that oil, so normally I would change oil then run the car for 100-200 miles then drain again, is not cheap due to oil price, also I wouldn't dream of running any other oil then from manufacture in auto boxes. Biggest problem with car manufactures is they claiming is sealed for life and they correct but what they mean is (LIFE OF GEARBOX), I don't have problem with mine yet in insignia that done 74k now but I have change oil 3 times now in gearbox and will continue to change this now once a year. I'm not gearbox specialist but had a pleasure dealing with ZF manufacture and not going to name the car brand but even ZF them self said they advising to change oil every 40k, there is no oil on this planted that will last longer then this, there is lot of parts in valve body, normally there cogs in gearbox is self and bearing are fine.

I do hope I'm wrong in your situation but I dealt with 2 gearbox in past and both required refurbish. Also there has been reports that on some insignia software update to gearbox improves jerkiness when you select gear but is no guarantied because of the valve body faults.

[Sysek]

So I took it for a first ride after oil change (3xtimes flush) and gearbox reset as mentioned above. Gentle ride initially seemed promising , Im quite sure it went to 3rd gear smoothly. Then when I've stopped and started couple of times gently accelerating , when reached an inclining part of the road then it went into limp mode 2nd gear giving out those codes (photo attached). Really sharp thud in D and R even worse than on cold gearbox (box oil at 78’C) .
Ade555 thanks for your option as i think it would se similar on mine that the solenoids are clogged (or some of them if not all). Only one active code was the P0732 which is the 2nd gear ratio.
Does anyone have an experience with stripping the body valve and solenoids themselves? Looks like new body is about £500 and can be replaced with greabox in place. Don't wont spend money and time on one thing that could not solve the entire problem which I don't know of.
.

Thanks

[ade555]

I do wonder if your codes are related to incorrect adaptation, some auto boxes after restet you have to do a sequence of other things to get the pressure on plate ect sorted out also might require longer drive, I'm more experienced on ZF gearboxes but will look in to this now see what a can find about this valve body.

Like I have said before sometimes changing oil is just to late.

I would only replace valve body once had a visual inspection of gearbox to make sure all bearing/cogs are fine. I'm sure you will be able to find parts to refurb valve body it self but is not for faint hearted. Might be a option to remove this your self and get someone to do recon.

Also can you press that brake pedal very hard when you move to D and let me know what it happens.

[Sysek]

Hi All,
I've done some play with and getting in grips with GDS2

Firstly ade55 asked for pressing brake hard when engaging D and R on cold engine/box see video :

https://photos.app.goo.gl/LBHL6c5VBeREyYsk6

Secondly I have took it for a second and third tst drive.

Second went generally good with no DTC faults thrown. Although as box oil gets hotter the harsher jerkiness is when car stopped and engaged D or R .
So did some investigation within the solenoids and found that changing the current mV on all of them gives you click or rattle sound from the valve body box.

Third test ride did not go so well the P0732 2nd gear ratio fault generated and limp mode activated after 5 mins of drive with stop start and drive on quite an incline and descent. Code cleared fine but that not the solution to a problem.
Checked current voltages on the solenoids and found that clutch pressure control valve 1 ( see pic) its not giving any click or rattle when commanding higher mV to it. All others do either rattle noise at 800mV ( not sure if healthy that is?). Shift solenoids 1&2 gives nice click when switched on and off which sound healthy to me.
So to me sounds like there is a problem with that "clutch pressure control solenoid valve 1" which gets command to and change the current but does sound as dead.
Although there might be something else I'm missing? Any thoughts?

p.s. let me know if video works as this my first video upload

[ade555]

Video works fine

hmmm wonder if you have to relearn the TCM after adaptation reset, normally this is required only after gearbox repair or valve body replacement or TCM, I always had same view you don't reset the adaptation on just oil change.

Now I have some info regards this and it might be worth trying this, you doing this on your own risk, in other brands the software will allow you to activate the solenoids with out messing with current so not sure how this works on this GDS2 as I don't have it, but looking at this topic you have reset the learn value in TCM which you need to learn this again so this info below might work.

Service Bulletin - AWF21 & AF40-6 (Aisin Automatic Transmission)
BULLETIN_AWF21.pdf (50 KB)
BULLETIN_AF40-6.pdf (50 KB)
YOUR WARRANTY DEPENDS ON YOUR ADHERENCE TO THESE GUIDELINES

Relearn Procedures
After replacing the transmission, replacing the TCM, or reflashing a TCM, you must perform the following relearn procedures:

NEUTRAL POSITION LEARNING
• Verify that the N position mark on the TCM is positioned correctly with the manual arm shaft and adjust as necessary.
• With the ignition ON and engine OFF, release the shift lock and place the shift lever into the Neutral position.
• Verify with a scanner that Neutral has been selected. Factory scan tools can input a Neutral signal to the TCM to inform the TCM that the Neutral position is selected.
• Turn the ignition off after releasing the shift lock and place the shift lever into Park.
• Turn the ignition on for 5 seconds and then shift into the Drive range and check that the indicator light displays the correct position.
• Once completed perform the Initial Learning procedures

INITIAL GARAGE SHIFT AND GEAR SHIFT LEARNING
Warm up the vehicle by idle or city driving until the transmission fluid temperature has reached between 66° to 110° C (150° - 230° F). During this time, note the degree of shock during garage shifts and gear shifts and compare after the following relearn procedures:

GARAGE SHIFT LEARNING
• Place the selector lever into Neutral and hold the brake for 3 seconds.
• Then place the selector lever into Drive and maintain this position for 3 seconds.
• Repeat this procedure 5 times.
• Then repeat this same procedure with Reverse.

GEAR SHIFT LEARNING
• From a standstill, take off in the Drive position with the throttle opened between 25% to 35% until sixth gear and 80km/h (50 mph) or higher has been reached.
• Then release the accelerator pedal and coast down to a stop in 60 seconds minimum.
• Repeat this procedure 10 times.
• Once completed, verify that the degree of shock during garage shifts into gear and shift changes have decreased as compared to conditions before starting the re-learn process.

[lizzard-t]

I'm sticking my 2 pennies in here .
First off ( and this is just to clarify your symptoms)
I see the op had a problem with a 2014 insignia that was violently shaking in drive !
Has yours got exactly the same problem?
Is yours a 2014 model ?
If not then I think it maybe a good idear if someone from Admin could separate the 2 problems into different threads with different headings so if anyone with the same issue will be able to find an answer to there particular problem quickly?
Makes it look Tardy, and I'm a bit of a clean freak on the forum I work on .
( just a suggestion of mine )
It's just that it makes it easier if everyone started there own thread rather than " tagging " onto an old thread with a similar kind of problem?
Down to your problem and I've been reading your issue and sitting back .but here's my therory
1) TCM re-learn should only be carried out when refurbished or replaced transmission or TCM replaced .
So trying to get it to re-learn on a transmission that has another problem will not work .
2) you say you flushed the transmission x3 did you do it as per ADE555 ? Or just drain , fill , run through gears , drain , fill , run through gears , drain , fill , run through gears ? Like that ?
3) the fault code P0732 relates to gear 2 incorrect ratio .
But relies on info to the ECU about
Throttle position
Engine RPM
Transmission output speed
At all times ,if any of the above are not present or correct in value then EML lights
It can relate to ( to name a few )
A) slipping in and out of gear
B) Erratic shifting behaviour
C)won't shift in or won't shift out of second


Here comes the crunch
Causes
1) dirty transmission fluid or filter
2) not enough transmission fluid
3) Damaged wiring connectors
4) failed transmission pump
5) failing Torque converter clutch
6) failing solinoids
7) blocked pressure passages
9)valve body issues
10) TCM failure or loss of communication

Now in my mind ( and I'm sorry to say this )
I've seen this kind of scenario before with this gearbox
And it has turned out to be
Failed valve body
Or solinoids
First off make sure you flushed it the correct way and drove at least a couple of hundreds miles between changes and repeated the process at least 3 times .
But I think in the end you are looking at valve body Aera , the solinoids can be changed but trying to get them can be a faff .
Hope I'm wrong but
At least I've got it off my chest !now I can sleep soundly tonight!
10-3 rubber gloves.